Transcript of interview with Ezra Beck, January 18, 2003

Judy Cherbonneau:

Mr. Beck, were you drafted or did you enlist?

Ezra P. Beck:

I enlisted.

Judy Cherbonneau:

And where were you living at that time?

Ezra P. Beck:

Atlantic City, New Jersey.

Judy Cherbonneau:

And how did you feel about, ah, enlisting?

Ezra P. Beck:

Two things; a little bit of patriotism and b. there was no work in the hometown; let's be honest.

Judy Cherbonneau:

And what branch did you select.

Ezra P. Beck:

Army Air Corps.

Judy Cherbonneau:

Were you happy with that choice?

Ezra P. Beck:

Yes.

Judy Cherbonneau:

And why do you feel that was the best selection?

Ezra P. Beck:

Well, it was a lot cleaner and out of the mud and let's face it, it was slightly glamourous compared to uh, the other branches of the service.

Judy Cherbonneau:

Could you tell me about some of your experiences at boot camp?

Ezra P. Beck:

Ah, actually, there was no boot camp, in 1939. You took your basic training with the organization you were going to serve with. So I took basic training at Mitchell Field, New York and I took my cold weather training at Madison, Wisconsin in December 1939. And the interesting thing about the cold weather training was on November the 6th, 1940 they sent us to Panama. Including, including the snow plows and all the cold weather gear. And we ended up...I could talk for hours. We ended up, picture a bombardment group of over four thousand people from the city of New York, most of us were city boys; ending up in a gunnery camp eight six miles west of Panama in the jungle. No...you couldn't drink the water. The only bath you could take would be if you went to the beach or it rained. Um, the Pan-American Highway was built, but there were no bridges. There were seven bridges between us and the canals and they were isolated. Any more questions on that? I could talk for hours!

Judy Cherbonneau:

During World War II, ah, where were you stationed?

Ezra P. Beck:

During World War II, we had moved from Panama to Trinidad in August of '41 and I was actually in Trinidad on December 7, 1941 and from there on it was a series of temporary duty to bases in French, Dutch, British Guiana, Brazil, and sometimes as far as the coast of, the west coast of Africa to the Gold Coast to ferry aircraft.

Judy Cherbonneau:

What were some of your duties?

Ezra P. Beck:

Basically, I started out in the maintance area and then I got into the operations end of it which was mainly scheduling the aircraft, ah, going along on particular missions and keeping records and so on. I was never, I was never a combat crew member, although I did have to take combat crew training.

Judy Cherbonneau:

And that combat training consisted of...?

Ezra P. Beck:

Consisted of becoming an expert on a fifty caliber machine gun because everyone had to be cross trained.

Judy Cherbonneau:

Did you have any, ah, special friends that you pal around with or that you were attached to?

Ezra P. Beck:

Actually, when I left Atlantic City, my daughter's (Ezra means to say, sister, as mentioned later on in the interview)fiancee' was one of the men who enlisted with me and he was in the unit with me for quite some time and so, ah, he was detached to other duties. He actually moved to Panama and Trinidad with me; interesting.

Judy Cherbonneau:

Now, you went on to the Korean War, ah, what exactly where...do you know where you were stationed, there?

Ezra P. Beck:

Well, it was downtown. I can't even think of the name of the actual place, but it was the largest city. Ah, I can't even think of the name of it and it was only temporary duty - in and out. But the same thing with the Korean War, with the Vietnam War, I would just ride an airplane and keep records.

So, I may be there for, anywhere from two weeks to a month, but I was never in combat in those areas, so the names of the airports and so on, escape me.

Um, that's the best I can do.

Judy Cherbonneau:

When you weren't in Korea or Vietnam, where did you fly back out to?

Ezra P. Beck:

Ah, I was stationed, one time, at um..I was trying to think of the name of the place. I was at Griffiths Air Force Base, toward the end of my career and that's when I went to Korea and before that I went to Vietnam from an air base in Texas, and I'm trying to think of the name of the Air Force base. I can't think of it. I'll come back to that. It'll come back.

Judy Cherbonneau:

What years were you in the military?

Ezra P. Beck:

I was in the military October 1939 until the end of August 1966. As a career soldier.

Judy Cherbonneau:

That is how many years, days and...

Ezra P. Beck:

That's twenty six years, ten months, and one day.

Judy Cherbonneau:

I knew you would know that!

Ezra P. Beck:

I know, I know!

I'm trying to think of the name of that damn base. Ah...Carswell Air Force Base, Texas.

Judy Cherbonneau:

Very good!

Were you awarded any medals or citations?

Ezra P. Beck:

Several citations including one, including one from a Chinese Air Force when I was instructing at Keelser Air Force Base, Mississippi, ah, in 1944 and parts of 1945. And the others are just Air Force and Army commendations, not real medals, not combat medals.

Judy Cherbonneau:

And this Chinese document we are going to photocopy and add in with the other documents.

Ezra P. Beck:

You will never find one of those!

Judy Cherbonneau:

No!

And what rank did you achieve while you were in...

Ezra P. Beck:

I was...I retired as a Senior Master Sergeant, an E-8.

Judy Cherbonneau:

And did you sustain any physical injuries while you were in the service?

Ezra P. Beck:

The worst thing that happened to me was in, in 1943, I got malaria when we were on the Gold Coast of Africa and I was invalided back to the United States on a hospital ship and ah, spent convalescent leave in New Jersey and spent forty two days in New Orleans trying to get a ship back to Trinidad and at that time you could not get out of (to)Trinidad because the Germans were sinking everything. You could see them burning..staying..in New Orleans, watched the burning. We actually saw fresh bread floating up. There were collaborators and so on and they would sink a sub. I spent forty two days in New Orleans trying to get a ship out and then eventually, had to go to New York by train to get a ship back to Trinidad. When I got back to Trinidad, my unit had moved from Africa and gone to England so I was allowed to finish my tour in Trinidad because I had enough points so I didn't have to go back into another combat zone.

Judy Cherbonneau:

Now, when you were in New Orleans, and couldn't get out, was there a reason why the ships, well, you said they were being torpedoed and you said, mentioned earlier in the (pre)interview about the steel mesh...?

Ezra P. Beck:

Yeah, we were told...I never actually saw it, but the Army engineers had an actual steel net. Or a series of cables across the mouths of the ports in New Orleans and the subs also had a device on the front of the sub, like giant pair of scissors that they could cut a hole in that and get in and plant mines and so on in the New Orleans harbor. This is a fact. So the ships didn't actually have to get out of the harbor, to blow them up in the harbor. It was a bad scene.

Judy Cherbonneau:

And that's something very few of us know anything about.

Ezra P. Beck:

It happened...it happened.

After Service

Judy Cherbonneau:

When you first came home from the service, ah, how had the service affected your life or changed your life in any way, when you finally got out in 1969?

Ezra P. Beck:

Yeah, 1966.

Judy Cherbonneau:

1966

Ezra P. Beck:

Sixty six...I was married with five children and ah, with some college and I had eighty nine credits but I didn't really want to go on and pursue a degree. So I got a good job with a defense oriented company, Sanders,

Sanders of Nashua and I was quite content and my wife was teaching at the time so I didn't really need any extra money. Ah, since I not been in real hand to hand or fierce combat the transition was fairly easy.

Judy Cherbonneau:

So you worked and lived in Nashua at the time?

Ezra P. Beck:

No, I lived here. I lived in Goffstown, New Hampshire and commuted and I stayed there for seven years. I've since then had other jobs...New Hampshire Insurance etc. Finally in 1966 (actual date would be later, it appears) we both retired and went on Social Security. End of story.

Judy Cherbonneau:

Do you recall the day your service ended?

Ezra P. Beck:

The day my service ended, I was very confused because I didn't know exactly what to do. My first inclination was to complete my college but I figured (with)the children in college, it was more important to go out and get a job, so that's exactly what I did. It was not very traumatic. The transition.

Judy Cherbonneau:

Did they have the G.I. Bill at that time?

Ezra P. Beck:

Yes, they had the G.I. Bill. I used it the G.I. Bill while I was in the service to pile up some credits, but I would take what I liked. If I like Psychology, I would take Psychology. If I liked something else, I would take it. But I never put it all together for a degree. I could still go back to college because I am a fifty percent service connected veteran and I could still go back and finish my college, but what for at eighty two? Why spend the government's money?

Judy Cherbonneau:

Did you ah, ah, continue any close friendships that you might have had in the service, after you, after you left the service, did you continue with any close friendships?

Ezra P. Beck:

Not really, not really because as I say, we left Atlantic City, New Jersey; seven of us; and four died during World War II and urn, the man, I talked about never did marry my sister. She married somebody else, so when I left the old hometown, it was kind of, I severed all ties. I haven't really kept up with any service people, but I do...I am a charter member of the Disabled Veterans of America and I'm a member of the V.F.W. and ah, I try to help local veterans, now.

Judy Cherbonneau:

How do you feel about the United States, after finishing your service and ah, the military now?

Ezra P. Beck:

I feel like most veterans...this is my personal opinion...that we are spread awful thin. We are in many, many countries and I don't know why we're there. And ah, I can see helping people out, but I can't see pouring money down a 'rat hole'. Now, I understand we have troops in the Horn of Africa. I am throughly confused. What are we doing in the Horn of Africa? We're everywhere and um, um, I imagine that the people at the top are guiding this ship somewhere, but I, I don't feel that we need combat troops in x-countries

all over the world. I've heard as high was ninety. I could be wrong. Of course that could be the Marine detachments at the embassies and so on, but that's a lot of military tied down doing just routine work .

Judy Cherbonneau:

Do you feel today's citizens are patriotic?

Ezra P. Beck:

Urn, yes and no. You're always going to have your protestors and, and, and I don't think anybody wants a war, especially the people who have to go out there and do the things that have to be done. I, myself, was never in anything like hand to hand combat, but I've been in and around it and I've seen the results of it, many times, and I think people get the wrong impression. I think...when I give a talk to a highschool, whatever, and I do, I tell them, look the military is a big family. You've got to have your dental assistants, you've gotta have your cooks and baker, the transportation people, your hospitals, all the education support people. It's just like a little town, only it's on a big scale and not everybody is out there throwing a grenade at somebody. There are the few that have to be sacrificed and I have never heard of anybody, yet, that says, " I am going to go out and die for my country." People will go because they're trained to do it, but I don't find many volunteers.

Judy Cherbonneau:

What would you do or say that might influence today's youth and younger generation about patriotism?

Ezra P. Beck:

I think that everybody should...there should be some kind of a draft or a program where everybody should do something. If you're a conscious objector, as I mentioned earlier, there's a million jobs you can do. Everybody should contribute to the effort. If we're going to have groups all over the world, they should be supported. In some way.

Judy Cherbonneau:

Is there anything you would like to add that we have not covered in this interview?

Ezra P. Beck:

I could tell you a lot of amusing incidents I better not because, because, I, some of them, some of them are pretty interesting. One time when I was on mission duty, in England, in civilian clothes, I was in charge of a registry of ultra, ultra top secret documents and the British have a, have a classification that's so high that we used to call it BBR...or burn before reading. And there was another one that was even on top of that was called RTSY...read then shoot yourself! And we would get this document and it would have a streamer on it and it would be delivered and it would say, action this day. You had to take action even if you got it ten minutes to twelve midnight. Once we got one that was so 'hot' that the next day, the British government came back and said you were not authorized to see that document. The initial sheet, where by your name, you saw...you read it, you will erase your initials and initial the erasure! That actually happened!

Judy Cherbonneau:

What might be included in one of those top secret documents?

Ezra P. Beck:

Oh, it was all top secret level plans, like NATO forces and ah military advisor groups all over the world, joint occupancy or documents that would list all the resources that France had in the tanks area or the British had in the sea area or the Americans had in the paratrooper area or whatever. And we were in a headquarters in England called The Joint American Military Advisory Group which oversee all, all these particular things. All the NATO countries; Italy, Belgium, France or Germany, etc. etc. And these documents would be passed freely around but there were some that the countries would not particularly want you to see because they had definite plans at the state level and when you got hold of one of those, either by accident or design, you had to sign your life away that you had read the thing and then, as I say,

sometimes you'd have to take it all back and say you didn't read it. That's the way it worked!

Judy Cherbonneau:

Is there one particular person that has influenced your life or a person you admire more than any, maybe?

Ezra P. Beck:

At one time when we were on mission duty in England, we were in a hotel on the sixth floor. We had to get my Marines and so on, it was a classified floor and one day, as I was walking down the hall, the elevator door opened and out walked General Eisenhower, General Bradley, um, a man who was a First SHAPE (Supreme Headquarters Allied Power European)Commander, Laurius Norstad and several other dignitaries and they were coming to visit our headquarters. I couldn't believe that I saw all this high powered, brass, in one place, at one time. There was...everybody was Four-Star or higher. There were three Five-Stars in there. There was a Navy man, I can't remember his name, and, and ah, we all, we all, we were all humbled because we showed great respect because these were the people who were driving the ship and we all gave great respect and I was thrilled.

Another time, to leave on a humorous note, when I was putting my daughter on my passport, in England, I wasn't at a military base. I was in civilian clothes and I had to go down...my daughter was born in London... and I had to put her on my passport so I could bring her back to the States; a man came in, a big handsome man, and walked by the line and went right into the Councils Office; it was Errol Flynn! And Errol, Errol Flynn had come back from Hollywood chartered an airplane, flew back to London, because he was being 'done' for a bill for twenty eight dollars that a landlord said he had not paid when he was making a film in England. And he was so incensed...he got his own airplane, flew all the way back. He was on a very

tight schedule and he mumbled an apology...there were three of us waiting...went right in to the, right in, and apologized on the way out and got back on his airplane and went back to California! That actually happened to me.

Judy Cherbonneau:

Do you know about what year that might have been?

Ezra P. Beck:

That was nineteen fifty four, the year my daughter was born. I couldn't believe it. But he was in such a hurry, but he did apologize! Can you believe it? Had nothing to do with the military, but here I am sitting and this big handsome guy steams by. We were upset. We said, "We're waiting, you know." And then he came out and he, "I'm sorry," blah, blah, blah; that was it. But, ah, so outside of that, nothing special. I, ah, I'm very lucky to be one of the ones that got back alive.

I don't know if I mentioned earlier, but when I applied to the disability to the VA, I found out that I am listed as a 'passenger' on two hospital ships and therefore, it just goes down to this... can you imagine somebody getting a thirty day leave in the middle of a war just to go home and have fun and come back? It doesn't happen that way. But that's the way my record reads because when I got malaria in Africa, and they flew me back to Trinidad to get on the ship my records from Africa and unit moved to England, my records went with them.

Judy Cherbonneau:

You mentioned earlier, in the discussion that we had, when your ship, when you had malaria and you were on the ship and it took you a few days to get off because...

Ezra P. Beck:

Oh yeah, we...I had the honor, the dubious honor of being on the first troop ship that ever pulled into Tampa, Florida. The levy in Tampa, Florida is about two feet high and it's over sixty feet up on an ocean liner to get off and

we couldn't get in...it was before New Orleans. We couldn't get into New Orleans so they took us to Tampa and we had stretcher cases, and I could walk and your leave starts today. You get to the United States, the Captain wouldn't leave us off the ship because the stretcher cases would lose two days leave so they kept us all on the ship and everybody lost two days leave while they built a scaffolding. It took them two days to build a scaffolding to get us off the ship! We were there...

Judy Cherbonneau:

You were there watching the carpenters...

Ezra P. Beck:

Helping the carpenters, cheering them on and the people were wonderful. They were there in their cars to take us home and give us a shower because we had saltwater showers. They were, the people were magnificent! And, and, my soldiering in New Orleans, for forty two days, I thought I would like to stay there, forever, on the way back. I had enough...

Judy Cherbonneau:

Did you ever, .were you ever stationed in a, in an area, or did you ever happen to have a leave in a place that was fantastic? A place that you would have liked to have retired in?

Ezra P. Beck:

Ah, I've been to Rome, twice. I've been to Norway, twice. Ah, Greece, other places, ah, Norway, Oslo, Norway has probably one of the cleanest, most delightful cities in the world. Um, that would be a great place. On the other hand, on the other hand, ah, um, Greece is wonderful, too, because of the climate, but urn, the good old U.S.A. is still pretty wonderful. I, I seriously considered retiring in Tucson, Arizona, which is a delightful place.

Or Richmond, Virginia. The only reason I am here in New Hampshire, because I got a decent, a better job and with the children in college, um, at the drop of a hat, I would go to any of those places, if I could, could. They were wonderful.

Judy Cherbonneau:

As long as it's the United States.

Ezra P. Beck:

Yes, I would take the United States. I don't want to be in a foreign country, permanently.

Judy Cherbonneau:

Well, Mr. Beck thank you for sharing your recollections with me and a bit of your life and I hope to do justice to your story and see that it is documented with the Library of Congress.

Ezra P. Beck:

I'm sorry that I'm a little hazy on where we were in and out with aircrafts, but you would come running in the middle of the night and land wherever you were, and the next day you were in a motel or hotel and you're on a bus or plane and you go out to a base and you get on another airplane and since I was not stationed there, I didn't really pay much attention, but I have been to Korea and Vietnam, not as a combat, and I want to make that very plain.

Judy Cherbonneau:

Thank you sir.

Ezra P. Beck:

Now, what are we going to do?