Interview with Lee Ewing [Undated]

Pat McClain:

I am interviewing Lee S. Ewing at Middle Road, Jeffersonville, Indiana. Date of birth, 10/27/45. My name is Pat McClain, and I'm on the staff of United States Senator Richard Lugar. Mr. Ewing, we appreciate you being here today. When you went into the Service, were you drafted or were you enlisted?

Lee Ewing:

Originally I was drafted. It was during the time of the lotteries and stuff. And originally I got a notice of draft, but because I didn't really want to go into the Army, I went and inquired at a Marine Corps recruit station. And I look back on that as kind of fun and not so fun because if I'd had went in under the draft, I'd had went in for two years. As an entlistee into the Marine Corps. I joined for four years, so it's -- it was a mixed bag, but as it turned out, I mean, I was glad I did go in the Marine Corps, yeah. And I joined in Lousiville, Kentucky, but I was living in Jeffersonville, Indiana, at the time. I went through my boot camp at Parris Island, South Carolina. I'm sure you've heard lots of stories about P.I., and mine is no different. I had just turned 20 years old before the morning I left to go to Parris Island. We traveled basically at night and arrived down there at about 4:00 in the morning in the pitch of dark. And here's these idiots get on the bus hollering and screaming, and I -- I -- I -- I will tell you, in all honesty, I was probably real scared. I didn't know where I was at. They made it sound like we was in the middle of no-man's-land, and right from the beginning I was probably pretty scared, you know, but I was -- I'm a guy who was raised up kind of in the streets, and, I mean, a good home life, but I chose a kind of rougher pattern of life than maybe I should have, but that -- that -- Okay. But, anyway, back down to Parris Island. Got put in platoons, and after you go through all the stuff of getting gear and getting jumped on right from the start, and got put into my platoon, 10,000 enrolled I believe it was the -- my platoon number, and started the process of training. This is when Vietnam was very early on in the process, and this was in '65. And they had just reduced Marine Corps boot camp from -- it had went from 16 weeks to 12 weeks, and we were the first set of recruits to go through on a eight-week-program.

Pat McClain:

Oh, my God.

Lee Ewing:

And we were told that everything that every Marine had gotten in 16 weeks was going to be crammed into eight weeks, and I truly believe they did that, because we had no free time to do anything. I'm originally from Lousiville, Kentucky, and -- and I went through boot camp with a bunch of guys that originated out of New Jersey and New York. There were other states there, but it was -- that seemed like that was the biggest population of guys in my platoon. And they used to tease me all the time about being from Kentucky and being a hillbilly and that kind of stuff. And -- and -- that was -- that like worked as a two-edge sword 'cause -- Jumping ahead a little bit, I graduated number one out of my Marine Corps boot camp class. And that means I was meritoriously promoted to PFC and put on a set of dress blues, and I was the top dog that day. Outstanding Marine.

Pat McClain:

That's great.

Lee Ewing:

It was right at Christmas when we graduated, about the 22nd or 23rd of December. And usually you go straight out from boot camp to what they call advanced training at Camp Lejeune, but because it was so close to Christmas, they allowed us our 30-day leave right out of boot camp. And they made no bones about it. They said, "The reason why you guys are getting leave right out of boot camp, because it's Christmas and -- and we're going to allow you to go home and see your families. And the reason being is 'cause 90 percent of you are going to get orders for Vietnam, and most of you will never see another Christmas, you'll come back in a body bag," and that's just the way the GIs told us. Of course, that didn't make, you know, -- when you're first out of Marine Corps boot camp, you think you can chew the world up and spit it out so you -- you just knew they wasn't talking about you, it was going to be the next guy.

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

But that's what I did, I took my 30-day leave. And this is -- I don't know how they're going to hear this, but it's just the truth. Some of the guys from Jersey and New York, they used to tease me all the time about being from the country, and they prompted me into seeing if I could bring some marijuana back when I come back 'cause they say Kentucky was famous for it. And in all honesty I wanted to get into these guys' favor. I just thought they was from the big cities, and I wanted to be -- belong. And the truth of the matter is I come home, and I did my 30 days and my leave, and I enjoyed myself, and -- but when I went back to Camp Lejeune -- Camp Geiger, I took some marijuana back. And to make a long story short, within a week or ten days one of the guys got busted and he told on me, and I got busted. And out of that thing, because they considered me the ringleader, I was given a general court-martial, the highest disciplinary action you can get in the military. And -- and out of that -- out of the court itself I received two years in Portsmouth Naval Prison, loss of all pay, lost my little PFC rank, the whole -- everything they could give you, plus they gave me a bad conduct discharge. And today I know, but -- anyway, my lawyer talked to somebody. I had a military lawyer, and he talked to somebody, and because of my outstanding record, as they put it, they thought I was salvageable. And they come to me with a proposition that if I would redirect my energy, so to speak, and learn disciplinary life, that they would cut my sentence in half, they would drop the bad conduct discharge, but all the rest would stand, and then they would put me back to duty after I did my time. Well, the truth of the matter is I didn't really want to do it out there, you know, but I didn't want that bad conduct discharge. I really didn't have any idea what that meant, but I knew it didn't sound good.

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

So I agreed to it, and I did 11 months total in Portsmouth Naval Prison in the brigs together, and I got out, and they gave me a different MOS. They made me a combat engineer, and they retrained me on all kind of heavy equipment. And I went through truck driver school and projectionist school and a few other little schools, and shortly after I got orders for Vietnam. On my orders it says I volunteered for Nam, and I -- I -- to this day I don't know if I actually volunteered, but I know things wasn't going well at Camp Lejeune. I was passed over a couple of times for promotion strictly because I'd gotten into that trouble. I will note I never got in any other trouble the whole time I was in the Marine Corps. But they passed me over. And -- and -- the first time they passed me over I figured that was par for the course. The second time they passed me over I went to my first sergeant and asked him about it, and we had a few words. And, true enough, the third time they come up I got my PFC ranking back. But I was shipped to Vietnam. Got over there, come in country through Da Nang, and stayed in the Da Nang area for about two and a half months. And -- and -- this was April of '66, something like that. April of '67. Yeah, '67. And -- and -- when I got in country, the Da Nang area was considered a pacified area, meaning that it was -- there wasn't any action going on. And we carried weapons. We -- I was still issued an M14 at the time, but you had to have a standing order to rock and roll. You didn't walk around with a loaded weapon. And -- and -- we would go in town into Da Nang and go to the little PX and do all the things that Marines do, all of them not so good. We did some things and -- and -- but it was -- I think it was all young stuff, and we didn't realize at that time where we were at and what was actually going on. I remember we had a sergeant come straight over from San Diego drill field and never been in a combat zone or anything. All this is -- I'm getting ahead of myself, because that was up north. That was after I moved up north. But, anyway, when I got to Vietnam, I was placed in a combat engineer outfit, and I was placed in a bridge company, Third Bridge Company, and I was a crane operator. And what I found out real quick is that you can't build a bridge without a crane, and you can't build -- and a crane is no good unless you have an operator. And I had what they called a critical MOS. And in my youth I used to -- when I first got it, when they told me I had a critical MOS, I thought that meant I was important. All right? And in combat lingo what that means, if you've got a critical MOS, that means in the event of a firefight or any hostile action, you're a primary target. And they say your life span is about six seconds in any firefight, and I said six seconds. I didn't understand that for a while until I was moved up north up to my base camp in the Chu Lai Phu Bai area. And -- and -- up there our assignment was to keep Highway One open. And for anybody who knows, Highway One was the main thoroughfare north and south. It carried all the large convoys and that kind of stuff. And -- and -- we were out probably seven days a week. Every now and then we would miss a day, but we would have to -- we'd have to go out, but we were out somewhere doing something seven days a week. And -- and -- what -- we didn't put in big bridges. We just put in what we call little fixed span bridges, and we'd patch holes and just anything to keep the highway open. And every now and then we did put in a -- we put in a floating bridge across the Perfume River one time, and we lost two guys to the river.

Pat McClain:

Oh, my God.

Lee Ewing:

We lost a couple guys in sniper incidents and that kind of stuff. And we built this floating pontoon bridge above -- across the Perfume River. Took us about 32 days in the field, and we bathed in the Perfume River, and -- and we got the leeches, and we got the -- you never -- you know, we bathed with our uniforms on, our ca -- our fatigues on. And -- and -- and I will never forget one night one of the guys fell in the river. He was walking guard duty on the bridge and the river was swollen, and -- and somehow he managed to fall in the river. I didn't witness this for myself. I found out the next morning. And one of his buddies on the bridge dived in to help him, and they both drowned. They found their bodies a couple days later down the river, but they both drowned. They both were in uniform and had their weapons, and so I'm sure that played some part, but I'm going to back up a little bit.

Pat McClain:

Okay.

Lee Ewing:

While I was down in Da Nang area, in this pacified area, I'm -- I guess I was a typical Marine. I wanted to see some action. I just thought, you know, I'm over here, I want to see some action. And with my MOS I never did have to go on patrols or anything like that, but this one particular day there was a patrol going out and somehow I got to volunteer to go out on it. And -- and -- my first combat casualty, another Marine -- and to this day I don't know what his name is. I couldn't tell you his name -- stepped on a land mine and literally blew him in half. I will never forget that day as long as I live.

Pat McClain:

Oh, my God.

Lee Ewing:

After all the chaos and excitement died down and we found out we wasn't actually being attacked, he had stepped on a booby trap, I seen this man laying on the ground. I mean literally with his legs and -- and part of his lower torso blown away and -- and blood coming out of his -- the corners of his mouth, and I -- and I -- I remember the corpsman telling me, "He's going to be all right. He's going to be all right." And his exact words was, "Don't bullshit me, Doc, I know I'm dying." And he asked for a cigarette. I will never forget this. He asked for a cigarette, and they gave him a cigarette. He took maybe two puffs off of it and died right there. I will never forget that. And -- And --

Pat McClain:

Oh, how horrible.

Lee Ewing:

And you got to understand, I thought I was a tough guy in the street and the Marine Corps boot camp made me think I was a tougher guy, and I saw this, and I literally threw my guts up. I mean, literally puked on myself. And -- and -- it is so significant in my mind, because I remember saying to myself, "I will never, ever allow anything else to make me feel this way again. Never." And -- and -- but we went back to base camp and the whole group, the medevac chopper, the whole group, and I never forgot that. And shortly after that we was moved up north, and -- and -- up there was when we started going out every day doing something. And just for numbers' sake, say, for instance, if we went out a hundred times, 96 of those times we encountered some kind of resistance. I mean, not -- nothing bad. Maybe just a sniper just taking crack pots at the crane or something like that. And I found out real early that they wasn't shooting at the guys working on the ground, they were shooting at the crane operator. That's when I found out about the critical MOS situation. I seen a lot of my friends got hurt over there. I seen a few of my platoons get killed. I seen a lot of Marines just wounded. On this one particular occasion -- I'm jumping way ahead of myself. I honestly -- I -- I -- I seen this Marine. We were in a firefight, and it was a big firefight. It was the day I got shot, and I'm really getting in front of myself, but I seen this Marine literally crack up right there.

Pat McClain:

Uh-huh.

Lee Ewing:

I mean, he was behind one of these little three-wheel motorcycles. I forget what they called them, and there was sniper -- not sniper fire. It was a full-fledged firefight all around us, and his -- his platoon leader told him to move up. And he was bumping up against this motorcycle, this little three-wheel Gia or something. I think that's what they called them. Just pushing up against it, pushing up against it and saying, "I can't move, Sarge, I can't move." And he was literally -- I mean, he'd literally lost his whole sense of where he was at. And I remember his platoon leader leveling his M16 at that kid and told him if he didn't move up, he'd kill him right there. And I remember me telling him, if he did, he'd be the next one dead. And -- and -- and I really don't remember how that situation played itself out, because it was crazy all around us, and -- and the next thing I know we were doing something else. But I had -- I'd been there for a while. This -- that particular incident happened February the 5th, 1968, because that's the day -- same day I got shot up over there. But let me go back earlier. Because we were out in the field so often -- I won't say to you I could speak fluent Vietnamese, but I could speak broken Vietnamese fairly good. And because we was in the field so often I -- I -- I got to know not -- not individuals, but I seen the culture of Vietnamese people, and I guess in a lot of ways I sympathized with them. I really did. When we were out building that bridge over the Perfume River, the floating bridge, there was a young lady, Vietnamese lady, very, very pretty. Her name was Lon (ph). And I don't know why I remember that woman so well, but she used to be our Coke girl. Coca-Cola. And every day she'd come out there with some Coca-Colas in tubs of ice and sit out there all day long and sell us Coke. And -- and -- she was almost like a warning signal, too, because she must have known because any time we was getting ready to get into any kind of action, she either wouldn't show up or she'd leave. And shortly after she'd leave, we'd know something was coming.

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

And, I mean, it took us a while to figure that out, but, like I said, we was out there about 32 days, and Lon would come out and we know it was a pretty good day going to happen. But if she leaved early or didn't show up, get ready for it, 'cause it's coming. And -- but I'll never forget her 'cause I thought she was so pretty. A lot of stuff, a lot of craziness happened over there. A lot of good, young men died, and I'm sure a lot of good Vietnamese died. I -- I -- I'm blank as you can see, but the tape doesn't show that. So I -- I -- I tried to not be prejudice towards anything. I try, but even today I -- I -- if I -- I'll tell you an incident, and this has nothing to do with the war. This is after I come back home, and I was working with this asphalt paving company, and I was a salesman. And I would go out and give estimates on asphalt driveways. And I always think I'm pretty diligent about where I'm at and what I'm doing, but this particular day I went to this complex here in Lousiville, Americana. And I was measuring this parking lot for the measurements for the asphalt that would be needed, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, and I was just really engrossed in what I was doing and -- and -- something triggered me, and I started hearing Vietnamese voices. And you're a local. You may know where Americana is. It's -- it's highly populated with Vietnamese and Koreans. It's out off of Third Street. And when I got out of what I was doing and realized where I was at, there was a bunch of Vietnamese kids just watching me and playing, and -- and -- I freaked.

Pat McClain:

Oh, God.

Lee Ewing:

I mean, I literally freaked. And this was years after I left Nam. For a long time -- let me -- let me back up some more. I -- I -- I -- even sitting here talking about this I --I'm getting chills, 'cause I'm reliving some things in my head.

Pat McClain:

I know. It's not easy.

Lee Ewing:

I've -- I've seen some things over there that I can justify and rationalize in my head because of the situations and the times, but, God, it's just -- you know, I don't want to slam Americans or Vietnamese, but there were some atrocities and things that happened over there. I've seen times when we'd be out and we'd lose a guy wounded or killed or something, and the next day the guys would be so angry they'd do things to get even and -- I mean...I can only speak from what I've seen, and I guess -- No, I don't guess. Well, even though I knew it was wrong, you sort of kind of look the other way 'cause you know the feelings that motivate it.

Pat McClain:

Right.

Lee Ewing:

And -- And.... But this -- this was my tour of duty in Nam. I mean, that -- that's -- I remember the country, me thinking the country was beautiful. I really did. The countryside and some of the landscapes, I really thought it was beautiful, but you'd go through areas of time where they had sprayed the Agent Orange, and everything was brown. Everything was brown down, and -- and... and -- and you said thank you for that, because you'd go through some areas where everything was green, and that was good spots for the VC and the Viet Cong to -- Vietnamese Red business and stuff to hide out and ambush you and stuff like that. So that was a mixed feeling. I mean, that whole time in my life was just a story of paradoxes. And I spent eight months and nine days in Nam. I didn't even get to do a total tour 'cause, like I said, I got wounded twice over there.

Pat McClain:

Did you -- did you fear the women and -- and children and old men? I've heard those stories, but I don't know -- I've not really heard it directly, let's say.

Lee Ewing:

I related the story about the young Marine that stepped on a land mind and died? I related how I told you how I would not feel from that day forward, and I remember thinking that I was going to die in Vietnam. All right? And I believed that to the depths of my being. And I said to myself, "If you're going to die here, you might as well enjoy the ride." And from that day forth I didn't fear in the sense of like that. Kids was kids. And I'm like most combat vets. I have seen children die over there. All right? And -- and you hear the stories of the kids getting prompted with grenades and that kind of stuff.

Pat McClain:

Right.

Lee Ewing:

That stuff is as true as anybody could tell you, but for whatever reason that particular type of incident never happened. All right? I will tell you an incident later on that I was involved in that I still see myself almost as a third party. I see -- I know I did it. I know it happened, but when I -- when I think about it, it's like I'm sitting looking at the scene and -- and there's a Marine doing this, this, and this, but it just couldn't be me. But, anyway, I will tell you about that.

Pat McClain:

Okay.

Lee Ewing:

But I.. I did some things in Nam that, when I look back on it, it scared me. Right, wrong, good or bad, I got involved in the drug scene a little bit over there. I smoked a little weed.

Pat McClain:

But that wasn't unusual.

Lee Ewing:

No. That was par for the course.

Pat McClain:

From what I heard, I heard that was par for the course.

Lee Ewing:

That was par for the course in some outfits, and no -- we wasn't a combat outfit -- we wasn't supposed to be a combat outfit to beat the bushes all the time so a lot of our guys did smoke a little reefer every now and then. There was -- by us being out and going through the fields and stuff, we found the little skinny houses. And I don't know if you know what that is. That's the little whorehouses.

Pat McClain:

Okay.

Lee Ewing:

All right? And -- and -- I just felt like, if I wasn't going to ever get back to -- to civilization, I might as well enjoy what life I could over there. And -- and -- and -- I don't know if you could understand, if you go out every day and somebody's shooting at you every day and you get back in, you say thank you in one way, but you say, "Well, I might not make it tomorrow so, what the hell, I'll go for it." And that's the way I lived my life in Vietnam.

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm. Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

I don't know if that was good or bad, but I know --

Pat McClain:

Do you think that the -- didn't -- I mean, to me that would be -- help sanity.

Lee Ewing:

Oh, God, that's what I'm saying. I -- I think -- 'cause I seen guys constantly worrying about what's going on back home, worrying about not getting back and worrying and worrying and worrying, and -- and -- some of them didn't. And -- and some of them that did, they made themself sick. I mean, they really had worried themself sick. My -- there was supposed to be two crane operators in my unit, myself and a guy named Pat Dunn. And I don't know why these names are coming back, 'cause some of them I haven't thought about in years, but Pat was so scared. I mean, he was so scared because you have to see this little bay city crane that I'm talking about built on a truck. It had beanie marks all over it from sniper fire. And, I mean, the crane would draw the fire, not the guys working, the crane would draw the fire. And Pat was so scared. After I got in Nam and, of course, he'd been there a month or so before me and he really wasn't the best operator in the world, and I think mainly because he was so scared. He had gotten married right before he come in the Service. He had a new baby on the way, and he's so afraid that he wasn't going to get back home. Somehow we got -- and I -- he could do the maintenance on the crane, but -- what we call the preventative maintenance on the crane. And I hated the greasing and the chore part of it, but I liked the operating part. So we made a deal, I'd operate, and he'd do the maintenance. And -- and -- you might -- you have to understand, some of my operating days was 12 and 15 hours, because we'd go out in the morning and we'd operate until dark, you know. Sometimes we'd set up lights, but we didn't do that very often, depending on when we was at, because nighttime was Charlie's time.

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

But Pat would do all the PMing, and I would do all the operating. We were supposed to -- you know, whatever the time was ours we -- it was supposed to be split in half, but I didn't mind operating and he didn't mind the maintenance as long as he didn't have to get shot at. So a lot of times he wouldn't even go out with us or he'd stay in the -- in the compound and fix on other materials, other equipment. But... you asked -- I -- I truly think my attitude is pretty much what got me through. I really do. I also know that that night carrying an -- an attitude, I brought it back with me, and it took me years to -- to kind of alleviate it from my life. Still to this day I truly believe, and for another reason. I'm a recovering alcoholic and addict. I've been sober now for 11 years, but I truly believe in living in today, but it's for a different reason, but I truly believe in living for today, and it's not hard for me because I had that training way back in Nam when I didn't know what I was doing. My -- my first Purple Heart incident, it happened while I was still down in -- in -- in Da Nang. And we call them sappers come across the perimeter wall one night and had these satchel charges, just like a book -- a little bag with explosives in them, and they got them on a timer. And they come in and they blew up a bunch of trucks in -- in the motor pool and threw them in a couple foxholes or dugouts or whatever it was out there. Bunkers, that's what I'm trying to say. And the first one, the first charge that went off, it was at night, and we was in our little hooches. And the first charge that went off, automatically you're -- you're awake. You learn to sleep over there with one eye open and one foot on the floor. You literally do. So the first one that went off we was automatically awake and jump into your boots 'cause I also slept in my -- my fatigue bottoms. And you put on your boots the best you could, if you could, and -- and you run out. And as I was running out of the hooch, and this is the God's honest truth, I tripped on the stairway and fell. Scarred myself up because I didn't have on nothing but a T-shirt, got my riffle, and fell, and went to the bunkers. And -- and this little incident went on for a few I want to say hours, but it really wasn't hours. Time gets mixed up over there. But it went on 20 -- 25 minutes before they gave us an all clear and everything. And -- and -- somebody seen that I was bleeding, all right, and -- and --

Pat McClain:

And you didn't even know it.

Lee Ewing:

And I didn't even know it.

Pat McClain:

Oh, wow.

Lee Ewing:

And -- and -- But it come from me falling, but they said it was in the act of combat, and somebody turned it in to my CO and my CO turned it in, and that's how I got my first Purple Heart. So I really -- I mean, I got it, but it wasn't no big thing in my opinion. The second one I took three 18 47 rounds for it, and -- and that was February the 5th, '68. And -- and in all honesty, I think that when it -- when I was awarded my first Purple Heart, they had a USO group over. And -- and they wasn't entertainers, but a lady named Ina Boline, I will never forget her, and she told us that she wasn't a singer or anything, she -- she just wanted to come over and show support for the troops. And it wasn't -- I think there was about three of them, but I remember Ina Boline because --

Pat McClain:

It's a pretty name.

Lee Ewing:

Yeah, and she wasn't a movie star, quote, unquote, but she -- she presented my Purple Heart to me and kissed me on my cheek, and I will never forget that.

Pat McClain:

Oh, wow.

Lee Ewing:

And that was when we was in base camp and, you know. We were up north at that time, because it took that long before they actually got the Purple Heart citation. Or had we gone north? No, I think we was still in Da Nang when that happened, Da Nang area, but, anyway, that's how I received my first Purple Heart. And after I was shipped up north, like I say, we went out every day. And -- and some days we didn't encounter anything, but you -- you always on edge. You never, ever know who's going to get it, what -- what's going to happen, you know. You don't talk about it, you know, because you don't want to really acknowledge that -- that you may die, but it's always in the back of your mind, you know. When -- when you load up and -- and -- you load up in bulk trailers -- bulk is what we call the materials we used to be able to fix span bridges. We'd load up in bulk trailers and -- and head out the next day. And, you know, I can't say what other people was thinking, but it was -- you know, it was always a conscious thought that maybe this is your day, you know. And then I'd use some kind of expletive and say, you know, got to go anyway, so I do what I got to do. I -- You know, this thing that's going on now with the terrorism and stuff, and -- and -- my heart goes out to any combat person, anybody in -- in the line of fire, but I -- I hear so much talk about patriotism, and -- and that's a real pretty word, but the first time you're in a combat situation and somebody's shooting at you, all that patriotism stuff goes out the window. It's about me saving my buddy's ass and he saving my ass and me saving my own ass. Some -- some military people may not see it that way, but everybody I've ever known that's actually been in combat, they -- they know that this is real. It ain't about mom and apple pie anymore, --

Pat McClain:

Right.

Lee Ewing:

-- it's about trying to get back home. And the only way you're going to get there is do your job and protect your buddy because you know your buddy's got to protect you.

Pat McClain:

Absolutely.

Lee Ewing:

And -- and, you know, I don't know too many of them that's out there waving the flag when they're getting shot at. They're just trying to survive and -- and make it back home, and they know the only way to do that is kilavicio (ph). And -- And that ...that mentality is... t's hard to shake. When I come back to -- let me -- let me -- I don't want to go there yet. I remember -- and -- and this is after we'd been up north and we'd been out and lots of stuff had happened in the months that I was up there. It seems like forever, but in all actuality, to be honest, I was probably in the northern sector of Vietnam maybe five months, and -- and I don't know how many people I saw either wounded or killed in that five months' time. On -- in -- in December, January, February of 1967 -- '68, that was during the time that they call the Tet offensive.

Pat McClain:

Right.

Lee Ewing:

And -- and this was supposed to be the most fierce fighting in the whole Vietnam War that -- during that era. And they had blown up the big, old bridge that crossed the Perfume River in the City of Whai (ph) and we were the bridge outfit and we got orders to go in there and see if we could make it passable. And we loaded up everything we had to go, and they gave us two platoons, a Marine Corps recon to -- for security, so to speak, and we loaded up and headed out. And -- and Whai is about -- it was about, oh, 15 clicks north of Phu Bai Chu Lai area. And -- and -- we -- we went there -- we went toward Whai pretty much with no resistance, but we got to a little tributary that feeds into the Perfume River. It's got about a 60 or 70 foot, maybe a hundred foot, fixed span bridge that went over this little tributary waterway. And we stopped our convoy and -- and to sort of recon the bridge for explosives and see if it was booby-trapped. And I remember there was this, like, a palon-type structured building that was built over it. It's like a -- to tell people they could come back and forth across the bridge 'cause it wasn't --

Pat McClain:

It was a single --

Lee Ewing:

Yeah, a single-lane type bridge. And I remember noticing it, and -- and the spanning (ph) Charles Sheehan and -- I don't know why I never mentioned him before, because he goes way back. He goes -- We went through boot camp together. And then, for whatever reason -- I know -- I remember the reason. Sheehan had to get permission to join the Marine Corps, because he joined at 17. He had to get written permission by his parents, and we went through boot camp together. And he didn't get orders for Nam because of his age. I'd gotten in trouble, right? --

Pat McClain:

Right.

Lee Ewing:

-- and I was gone for almost a year. And then, when I got back to Lejeune, Sheehan and I, we was reunited in that bridge outfit that -- well, we was in heavy equipment school together. And then, when we got orders, we got orders for Nam together. And when we got to Nam, we got orders to go to this company together. And then when we went to the company and we got orders to be in the same platoon together. And he's really significant in my mind. And I don't know if you -- other people remember stuff like this. Sheehan was a white guy from Connecticut. Like I said to you, he was 17 years old when I met him and, for whatever reason, we just kind of took a liking to each other. His name was Charles Sheehan. And it used to bother me so bad for years I could not think of his first name. I mean, you might think that's silly, but --

Pat McClain:

No.

Lee Ewing:

-- it bothered me so bad. And -- and I liked his last name. His last name just seemed slick to me, --

Pat McClain:

Uh-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

-- Sheehan. But anyway, Sheehan admitted he had a few first with me, first things -- first time ever in life, and one of the things, first time he ever smoked a joint, first time he ever got laid, and I don't mean to be nasty, but --

Pat McClain:

No. Fine.

Lee Ewing:

-- and the first time he ever drank a beer. We was together all through those firsts, and -- and -- he kind of looked up to me as the big brother, and I took a liking to him, and... to make a long story short, that day when we was crossing that bridge, he got killed, and he was in the original firefighting that broke out, because he was the M60 gunner and he had his machine gun, and they was walking across the bridge and -- and -- and all hell broke loose. They got about midways on that bridge, and all hell broke loose. There was a bunch of the guys out of recon unit. I didn't know any of them personally, but a bunch of Marines, and -- and all hell broke loose. And I'm -- I'm back further in the convoy. I don't know what -- exactly what's going on. I just hear all the gunfire, and then we catch -- start catching fire from the vills on the side of us and... But, anyway, that went on. I mean, this was one of those things that just went on and on and on and on. And it filtered back to me one of the other guys in the unit said that Sheehan had gotten killed. And -- and -- I didn't cry, but I hurt. No, I'm still getting in front of myself. Before I was informed that Sheehan had gotten killed, we were getting fire from some units in vills, some houses in the vill. And -- and we got orders to go in and see if we could clean it out. And myself and about three other Marines went into this little vill down this little path, and we went, like, house to house. Right? And -- and -- you have to understand that Vietnamese houses aren't like American houses. A house may be one fairly large room or -- and a fairly large room would be a little bigger than this whole room. That would be their whole house, and maybe some little partition in it or something like that. And we were going from house to house and in broken Vietnamese saying, "come out if you're -- if you're civilians," because this is the city. "We won't hurt you if you're civilians," and -- and -- nothing happened for a minute. And I remember stepping, you know, around into this one house and saying my little thing about come out in broken Vietnamese or in broken English or whatever and -- and something -- and it took me a long time to even admit this -- something caught my eye, and for a few seconds I was -- I wasn't where I was at. And -- and when I got no response from the house, I went in. And whatever it was that caught my eye, I was going towards it. And something in the background, I heard a movement, and that's all it was was slight, slight movement. And I just whaled. And I was carrying a 16 and I whaled, and I fired, and I emptied a clip. And I killed three people, and one was about a three-year-old child, three -- four-year-old child. And -- and -- the other Marines heard the gunfire and, when they got to the house, I was backing out. And -- and I will never forget it. One of them said, "What happened? What happened, Ewing?" I said, "Let's go." He said, "What happened, Ewing?" I said, "Let's go, goddamn it, let's go." And nobody from that day to this -- well not this. I told at least -- but for the next 24 years knew what happened in that vill -- in that little hooch. And -- and I carry that, and I'm talking about this whole scenario didn't take 20 seconds. I mean, the whole -- from the time I got to that door to step in and whaled and fired and back out was no more than 20 seconds, and -- and I know... these were civilians and I -- you know --

Pat McClain:

But you didn't know that.

Lee Ewing:

No, I know. That's what I'm saying. I know I -- I rationalized and justified, but I still feel it.

Pat McClain:

Oh, I'm sure.

Lee Ewing:

And -- and I'm telling you to this day I could live -- well, I live with all of it, but if it was just the two grown-ups, it probably wouldn't have bothered me nearly as much.

Pat McClain:

Right.

Lee Ewing:

But when I seen that little child -- and I'm telling you the whole scenario wasn't to 20 seconds.

Pat McClain:

Right.

Lee Ewing:

And -- and for years I had crazy, crazy, dreams about it, nightmares, and -- and when I would -- when it would come up -- and believe me, I didn't bring it up, it would come up, I was always like watching the scene. It wasn't me pulling the trigger. It wasn't -- you know, it was a Marine there, but I was sort of like hovering watching the scene, and ... it took me 24 years to tell anybody that story. I remember -- this is another whole strip -- Vietnam stuff, but I got involved in drugs and alcohol real heavily after coming from Nam, like a lot of guys did. And -- and I was at my end, but this is 24 years after being in the country, and I went out to VA Hospital. And I don't know if they didn't think I was serious, but I remember sitting out there nine hours in their emergency room before I got any treatment. Nine hours. They was saying the psychiatrist wouldn't be in and dah-dah dah. But I sat out there nine hours, and I remember when I actually did get in to see one, he, you know, real lightheartedly, what's your problem. And -- and -- I started talking and, for the first time in 24 years, that story come up, and -- and he put me straight on the seventh floor. But it took me 24 years to tell that story. I remember -- I laid in the hospital for five months. I'll tell you about that. I got shot up that day too.

Pat McClain:

Right.

Lee Ewing:

But I remember after getting out of the hospital coming home and my mom happy to see me and all that kind of stuff, and -- and she said, "Well, what happened over there? What happened?" And I started to tell her a couple of things about what had gone on in Nam, and she said, "I can't take it. Just, you know, don't -- don't tell me no more." And I knew then, if my mother who loved me and brought me into this world and could not stand to hear it, then it wasn't supposed to be talked about, and I did not utter a word about Vietnam for the next 24 years. Now, I know today that that man would have killed me. I know that today, but I didn't know it then. There was a lot of other stuff that -- that... for the... for years I truly believe that eight months and nine days I spent in Vietnam affected every aspect of my own life. When I come back home, it was in '68. It was during the time of a lot of civil unrest, racial civil unrest, and I remember this as well as I remember the date. There used to be a store on the corner of 4th and Chestnut called W.W. Kresges. I don't know if you're from this area or not.

Pat McClain:

I'm familiar with Kresges, but -- and I know where 4th and Chestnut is.

Lee Ewing:

And -- and they had a little salad -- sandwich bar or, like, a Coke, you can get Cokes and stuff. And I remember going in there after I left Vietnam, spent five months, almost five and a half months, in the hospital, and I ordered a sandwich in there, and they told me I could buy the sandwich, but I couldn't eat it there. And my thought --

Pat McClain:

In '68?

Lee Ewing:

In '68. In 1968. And my thoughts is that you can go and kill for this country and damn near die for this country, but you can't sit down and eat a sandwich? And I will never forget that.

Pat McClain:

No, it's too sad.

Lee Ewing:

And I'm telling you right, wrong, good, or bad, when all the craziness was going on, I was right in the middle of it. I remember one of the local preachers, and that's when they was having all the demonstrations and all that kind of stuff, asked me because I was a veteran would I get involved in demonstrations and here's what is going to -- we can expect, dogs and water and all that kind of stuff. END OF SIDE ONE, TAPE ONE: BEGIN SIDE TWO, TAPE ONE

Lee Ewing:

But, anyway, after that incident in -- in the little hooch, in the little vill, I get back to my rig -- not my rig, my crane, and it filters back to me that this -- that Sheehan had -- had gotten hit. And -- and -- and I remember asking the guy that told me, I said, "Is he dead?" He said, "Yeah, Lee, he's confirmed. And they send -- they talking about leaving their bodies there." It was him and a guy named McCoy and a couple other guys that got hit originally. I found out later on that guy named McCoy got killed. He died three or four days later, but Sheehan was the original casualty, but we lost maybe four people that particular day on that bridge. You know, that little bridge site.

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

And -- and -- I remember saying that they was encountering such resistance of the bridge that they couldn't get their bodies back and they was going to leave his body. And I said, "Oh, no, they're not going to leave his body." And my lieutenant, his name was Lieutenant Johnson, who's a red-headed, white boy with freckles on his face, he's out of Chicago, Illinois, and he said, "Ewing, you're crazy. We can't afford to leave -- lose you." And I said, "Man, I'm going to get him, he's my friend." And -- and he and I had a little words out there in the middle of all this craziness, but he said okay. Oh, I remember it why he -- they said okay. About that time two Army heavy equipment -- pieces of heavy equipment, tanks like, with -- with -- with -- I don't even know what they call them, but they had big guns on them.

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

All right?

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

They rolled up, but they couldn't -- they were too big to get across the bridge. The width of them was too big to get across the bridge. And -- and they come up and they said, "What can we do?" And -- and -- and me and Lieutenant Johnson was bickering back and forth about me going across the bridge. I said, "I'm going to get this guy." I said, "When I start across this bridge, I want you guys to open up and do not stop until I get back." He says, "Can you pinpoint any f" -- "where you getting fire from?" Remember me telling you about that little buoy? It was sitting in the water. Sitting on stilts. It was concrete. He -- and they said, "Yeah, we've been getting fire from that bunker-type thing there." And I remember them two tanks turning their guns on that thing and literally obliverating it. And you could hear hollers coming out of that, screams coming out of that bunker, and I mean literally. And I don't -- I still to this day don't know what kind of tanks or guns they was, but they said tat-tat-tat-tat. A lot louder than that, but -- and shooting over it, and I mean, literally -- the only thing left was the stilts in the floor. I mean, literally obliverating it. He said, "Anything else?" And I remember telling them, I says, "Open your guns up when I start across that bridge. Don't stop until I get back on this side." And -- I can't think of his name either, but he was a white, Italian guy out of New York. He said, "Ewing, I'm going with you." I said, "Okay, but that's enough," 'cause every time they tried, they tried in fours, and they got more casualties. So we got up to the bridge, and -- and we started across the bridge, and we got fired on, but nobody got hit. And -- and the white guy out of New York said, "You grab the body, I'll cover." Now, I'm getting in front of myself because they had reported that Sheehan, when he originally got hit, he wasn't dead. And -- use this as the length of the bridge. All right?

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

We're on this side of the bridge, and the Army load backed up, and we had to cross the bridge. And Sheehan got hit approximately this part of the bridge. Right about here was an old burned out Jeep that had been hit and -- and abandoned, and they said Sheehan had got -- well, it was farther over, because it was right at the end of the bridge. And -- and Sheehan had got hit about here, and the Jeep was here, and -- and -- and he wasn't dead when he got hit, but he was out in the open. And -- and -- and I'm telling you this, and you'll see why in a minute. They said, when he got hit, he started crawling for this Jeep, and -- and I know what he was thinking, if I can get to this Jeep, I've got some cover. And some Vietnamese come out and run across the bridge and gunned him down out there. And the reason why I know this is because we had crossed the bridge. Right? We were over here. I grabbed the body and the other guys was shooting, and we just -- you know, it's John Wayne. It's crazy. No -- no rhyme or reason, but we -- and -- and -- I grabbed the body, and I start back. I get hit. All right? I'm thinking to myself, "If I don't get out of the way, I'm going to get killed," and I start crawling for the Jeep. Up to that point I'm laying exactly still, so I know this is what's going through his mind. When I get -- start to crawl, I hadn't -- had I gotten to the body? I hadn't gotten to the body before I got hit, and I started to crawl towards the Jeep and -- and -- and -- whoever shot me was shooting from above me and off to my right, because they -- I got hit in the foot originally, and I couldn't stand. All right? And -- and -- I went down, and that's when I started thinking about, "If I stay here, I'm -- I'm going to die here."

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

And -- and I started to crawl hand over hand towards that Jeep. And wherever they was shooting, they seen me moving, and they shot me some more. I had on a flak jacket that day. And -- and -- it's crazy, I hated them things. I hated them, but I -- and I wouldn't wear them half the time, and that would -- I'd always get into arguments with my lieutenant and everything, but that day I had one on. I think it's because we'd been in this firefight for so long, and I kept one in the rig. And -- and -- when I started moving for that -- for that Jeep, I got hit across my legs and across my back, but it didn't hurt nothing up here, because I had the flak jacket on, but I got hit two more times in this leg, and I laid completely still. And... I don't know how you hear this, but my words were, "If there is a God in heaven, now is the time you can help me." That's an exact quote. And I laid my head down right there to die, because I knew I was dead right there. I knew it. I'd heard how they'd come across and killed Sheehan, and I knew that was my fate. Mortars went off on that bridge, the small mortars. The Vietnamese was shooting from their positions went off on that bridge, and -- and -- and I just laid there. And I don't -- I couldn't tell you a time frame, and in all honesty I know it couldn't have been no more than 10 or 15 minutes at the most, but it seemed like forever.

Pat McClain:

Oh, I'm sure.

Lee Ewing:

And I remember the first conscious thought was I heard my lieutenant hollering, "Ewing, Ewing, are you all right?" And -- and for whatever reason that gave me courage and I hollered back, "I'm all right, but I'm hit, and I can't move." And -- and a little more madness went on for a little while longer, and -- and -- I heard something grab at my -- my -- my flak jacket. And I looked up, and it was Lieutenant Johnson, and I'm -- red-headed, white boy out of Chicago, Illinois, and I could have kissed him.

Pat McClain:

I bet.

Lee Ewing:

I could have kissed him.

Pat McClain:

Freckles and all.

Lee Ewing:

Yeah. And they drove us off the bridge. And -- at this point in time they'd been sending medevac choppers in medevacing the wounded and the dead, and -- and I remember them calling for a medevac chopper for me, and -- and -- and they saying that they can't get in, that they was getting too much heavy fire, they lost a couple choppers, and -- and -- and if we could get him out some away from the firefight, we might -- but -- my medevac is what we -- in the Marine Corps we called a PC, which is a personnel carrier, but a PC in the Marine Corps at that time wasn't no more than a three-quarter ton Jeep pickup truck. That's all it was. And my medevac -- Let me back up again. This particular Jeep had lost three tires. All right? One in the front and two in the rear. There was one spare. They changed the front spare, and they throw me in the back of that Jeep and medevac me to Amed, which is about 17 clicks away from where we were actually at, and that's how I got medevaced from my -- my wound -- I mean, my place where I got wounded, in the back of a pickup truck with two flat tires, and I'll never forget that. I'll never forget... the corpsman after they got me in the Jeep giving me a morphine Syrette. It's just a little vile of morphine hooked onto a needle. You hit it, squeeze it in, throw it away. But they're supposed to tag you when they do that to let you -- let where you're going to the hospital that you're going to know that you've received some pain medication. In the madness, I don't know if I took it off, he didn't put it on or I lost it, but I never -- when I got to Amed, I didn't have a tag, and the first thing they did was again hit you with another morphine Syrette. Now, the truth of the matter is, I didn't hurt. You know, I didn't hurt. And -- and -- it was a trauma-type unit, sort of like a MASH unit, and -- and they took you as you come in in the order of the degree of -- of trauma, --

Pat McClain:

Sure.

Lee Ewing:

-- how bad you're hurt. And the truth of the matter is, if they determine that there was a Marine that would take four hours of surgery and he'd probably going to die anyway, they set him in the corner and let him die. They didn't even bring him to the operating table. If they felt they could help you or something, you know, the worst wounded that they could actually help, that's the ones they took first and it went on down the line. And I got four inches of femur artery shot out of this leg and I got two bones shot out of my right foot, and they put an air tourniquet on my leg and -- and -- like I said, I got the second shot of morphine, and -- and -- man I didn't even -- I was blitzed. I really was.

Pat McClain:

I imagine.

Lee Ewing:

And I laid there a couple of hours before they actually got to me with this air tourniquet on my leg. And they opened my leg up. They grafted -- Did they do that there? Yeah, they -- that was the original surgery. They graphed a vein from my right leg and put it in place of the artery that I'd lost, and they left the wounds open, and they put me -- And I remember that night we had air strikes coming in, mortars coming in, and I remember them coming around dumping people out of their beds and onto the floor and throwing the mattresses on them. These are the people who'd gone through massive surgeries and -- and -- and -- and -- and putting them -- because we was getting incoming mortars. And I stayed at Amed for a week, and then I was medevaced to Yokohama, Japan. And I stayed there for a month, and -- and -- and they put some drainage tubes and stuff in my legs, and -- and -- but they left the wounds open. Oh, I know my wounds was open two and a half weeks after -- after Amed, and -- and I remember when I got 'em closed, I was in Yokohama, and they put stitches -- not stitches. Staples --

Pat McClain:

Oh. Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

-- to staple my things in my legs. And -- and -- I remember feeling a little strong one day, and they -- 'cause I'd been in bed all -- constantly in bed this whole time, and I'm a Marine and I ain't supposed to have to use no bedpan and I'm getting tough now, right? And -- and they told me, said, "you know, Ewing, you got to use the bedpan," dah-dah, dah-dah, dah. And about -- oh, I guess I'd had my surgery a couple days, a couple three days, and -- and -- I -- they told me, if I ever wanted to get up, if I just felt I had to get up, make sure to call the orderly and -- and get in the wheelchair and dah-dah, dah-dah, dah. So I'm getting tough now, and I muscled my way up out of my bed into my wheelchair, and I was going to the head to use the head like -- like men did. We don't use it in the bed. And -- and -- I got to the head and -- and it had some handicap rails and stuff, and I got up. I positioned myself around really using all my upper body strength to do this, and I'd sit down, and I did my do and -- and cleaned my stuff up, and I got up all with upper body strength, and -- and I tested my foot first, so to speak, and -- and -- it was sore, but -- but when I put any weight on it, I -- that leg got bent. And then I kind of tested my leg and I said, "well, maybe both of them together I can -- I can hold my strength." You know, hold my body up. And -- and -- I kind of let go of the handicap rails, and it was all right for a second, and I kind of started to take a step towards this chair, and I spit all of my staples out and I hollered -- Now that hurt.

Pat McClain:

I imagine that hurt.

Lee Ewing:

And I remember hollering, and I remember the orderly running in there, and you'd think that they would be real kind and considerate, and -- and he just told me, "I told you, damn fool, not to get up out of bed," but they had to rush me back to surgery and do some secondary surgery and that kind of stuff.

Pat McClain:

How long were you in the hospital there? Five months there or --

Lee Ewing:

No. I was in Yokohama, Japan, for approximately 30 days or a month, and then I was flown -- I came in I think through Virginia, West Virginia, or something, but then I ended up in St. Albans Naval Hospital up in Jamaica, Queens, New York, and I spent the rest of my time up there. About three and a half months up there, but altogether I was in the hospital about five months. And up there -- and I don't know how you hear this, but I -- from the day I got hit, from the very day I got hit, I had a drug that was given to me called Demerol, and I could get it four hours on the four hours. And -- and -- I tell the story like this. For the first month, month and a half, I probably needed that drug. I went through little surgeries and then busted it open and went through them again, and -- and I hurt. For the next month, month and a half, I might have hurt a little bit, but I -- I -- it felt good. And then, before I realized it, I was strung out on Demerol.

Pat McClain:

Wow.

Lee Ewing:

And I remember being up in -- in St. Albans Naval Hospital and Dr. Ball, orthopedic surgeon -- I don't know why these names are coming back -- but Dr. Ball did what they call a CMP or whatever, looked at me to assess my wounds and told me that due to my wounds, I was no good to the Marine Corps because I wouldn't be able to walk properly for a while and dah-dah, dah-dah, dah. And he asked me what would I like to do, and I told him, "I'd like to get up and go back to school", and he said, "Well, you'll need a certain amount of disability for the VA to pay for it." And at that time it was 30 percent. And he says, "I'll recommend you for a 30 percent disability, that'll make you eligible for the schooling," et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And -- and that's when I found out I was getting out of the military due to my wounds, but by then I was strung out on Demerol, and I was afraid to tell the doctors about this. I don't know why I was afraid. I just didn't want that stigma. I knew I'd been in that trouble with the reefer and stuff early, and I just didn't -- so I kind of muscled my way off of Demerol in the next few weeks. And -- and -- then, when I come home...life just wasn't what I -- what I left, you know. Life -- life just wasn't -- I got married real quick. I got out June the 17th. I got married July the 27th because my wife -- when I told my girlfriend -- we'd been going together for five and a half years. When I told her I was getting out, we'd already planned on getting married, but I -- in all honesty, I was lying the whole time. I figured I could get out of it in four years' time, but my tour of duty was cut off about two years. And -- and -- when I got home, she'd made all the arrangements for us to get married, and I just didn't have enough guts to say, "I ain't going to get married", 'cause she had sent out the invitations and everything. She says I agreed to all this, and I very well may have, but I don't remember. So I got married. And when I left to go to the Service, I worked out of International Harvester so they -- I had me a job, a good job, and -- and -- but wasn't nothing the same. And -- and -- And I used to think it was everybody else, but what I realized after a while, after 20 something years in calcium (ph) and posttraumatic stress disorder programs, that's when I -- it wasn't them, it was me. I -- I was different. And -- and -- all the guys and ladies and girls that I come up with through high school and stuff, the ones that didn't go in the Service, they went on to college or got jobs or got married or whatever they did on the streets, and they just -- and I was so serious and I was so angry, and -- and... I got into a bunch of trouble, drug-related trouble. I went to prison. I been to prison three times total, once in the Marine Corps and twice on the streets, and all of it was drug related, --

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

-- drug and alcohol related. That -- That's... you know. And, like I say, I got to the end of my rope that particular time when I went out to the VA and sit out there for nine hours in that emergency room before they talked to me, and that started me. And I say started because that time didn't work, but they put me up on 7 -- I think they put me on 7 South that first time, but I had been on 7 North. 7 South was open psych ward, 7 North was the locked psych ward. And I'd been up there more than I'd like to admit. And I remember them -- I remember asking about this posttraumatic stress program, and -- and I remember them telling me that I was a prime candidate for it, but they wouldn't even recommend me for it until I was willing to do something about my drinking and drugging, and that's how I got in the process. I really didn't want to stop drinking and drugging. I didn't think -- of course, that was my only escape from some of the -- some of my own head, --

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm. Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

-- and -- and -- and I did get into the -- an alcohol treatment program. They sent me to Marion, Indiana, and -- and I still got a little resentment about that 'cause the hospital they sent me to was a psychotic hospital, a psychiatric hospital. But I was in a drug treatment program, and -- and I used to look around that hospital at some of the patients up there who was really psychotic and schizophrenic and dual diagnosed and -- and, you know -- and I'd think, "What am I doing here," but now I know I was right where I was supposed to be, because I was just as crazy as some of them. And I went through the alcohol treatment program up there and I went through a posttraumatic stress program up there, and I was up there 80 -- 85 days, 89 days I think it was.

Pat McClain:

Wow, a long time.

Lee Ewing:

Yeah. Well, I went through the first program, and then there was a little lull, and they said, if I leave, I'd probably lose my space so they kept me up there. And then I went into the --

Pat McClain:

The second one.

Lee Ewing:

-- the posttraumatic, yeah --

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

-- and -- and -- but for the first time in I don't know how many years that was the first time that I could remember that I hadn't used in -- in 90 days, in 89 days.

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

And that -- that is real significant in my mind. I don't know how you hear that, but I'm coming out, and -- and I got involved with Alcoholic Anonymous -- well, at that time I got involved with Narcotics Anonymous, and I stayed clean for the next seven and a half months. And I don't know what triggered it. I know it wasn't nothing that triggered it. I -- Inside I wanted to get high, and this particular night I -- I found an excuse that was acceptable to me at that time, and I got high, and I got totally crazy for another two years. And when I did come back into the rooms of Alcoholics Anonymous, I was just beat down. I mean, I was just beat. The truth of the matter is, I didn't have nothing else to go or no place else to go or. And -- and -- I never was homeless 'cause I always worked. I mean, even when I was using, I worked, but I just -- I just... I'd gotten hopeless, you know. I'd even gotten suicidal. And I don't mind telling you this today. There was two different times I sit on the bed -- the edge of my bed with a pistol in my hand and put it up to my head, and -- and -- the -- the only thing that thought -- see, this is where I thank Vietnam for some things, 'cause I didn't want my family to come in and see me splattered all over the wall, because I know what a bullet can do to a human body. And, for whatever reason, I didn't want my family to find me that way, and that's the only reason I can give you that I didn't kill myself. That's the only reason I can give you. Not 'cause it was wrong or nothing like that. I just didn't want my family to find me like that. And I -- I started back in AA and for -- I went back into treatment. And it's the standard joke out at the VA at the time that they didn't know if they would even accept me back because I was violent. Some of the staff even admitted that they were afraid of me. But they -- they said they had a vote, and -- and I won by one vote to be kept. And -- and -- I went through the program, and -- and I've been clean and sober ever since.

Pat McClain:

And you said that's 11 years?

Lee Ewing:

11 -- June the 8th of 1991.

Pat McClain:

When did you get involved with the VAV?

Lee Ewing:

I guess I've been doing with them now for about -- about six or seven years? And -- and that wasn't really of my doing. I mean, an old friend of mine who's passed away now, I met him in A

Lee Ewing:

He was in the VFW. His name is Chester Swan, and he asked me to join the VFW when he found out I was an ex-Marine and a former Marine. And -- And I -- In all honesty, I didn't want to have anything to do with anything that was government related or military related, and Chester was -- he -- he was like my sponsor, and -- and I respected him highly. And he asked me, and I said, "All right. I'll go to a meeting with you." I got into VFW. And, damn it, I mean, I wasn't there a hot minute before they put me to work. And that had to be seven or eight years ago, nine years ago, 'cause -- and I'm still the quartermaster for that particular chapter. I can't get out of the Job.

Pat McClain:

Well, how was your trip to Washington? Were you able to meet all the legislators?

Lee Ewing:

No, and I wasn't able to meet with Lugar in his office or all the other ones, but I did get to see Senator Bunning and Congressman Rogers from Kentucky. And the reason why is because one of the other guys had set up the meetings earlier. The only problem of not getting in to see your people was I just waited too late. All right? But I won't do that next year. I got to go next year.

Pat McClain:

Yeah.

Lee Ewing:

But it turned out well. It turned out well.

Pat McClain:

Good.

Lee Ewing:

And going back Wednesday, the National Executive Committee, which consists of 23 committeemen and all the line officers from -- there's five line officers on the national level that included the Commander and the ajutant. We were -- we lobbied the Joint Committee for Veteran's Affairs --

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

-- and we got an audience with them and -- and --

Pat McClain:

Oh, good.

Lee Ewing:

-- our Commander gets to give a spiel on what we're looking for in our budget this year and that kind of stuff and. You know, to me -- you don't know me, but I'm -- I'm originally from the west end of Louisville. I come from a family of 11 children, I'm number five on that list, and I kind of -- I come from a poor background. And for me to be able to go sit down and talk to congressmen and senators, to me, that's kind of awesome. That's kind of mind-blowing. Especially with my drug past and history. And -- and to think I've come from being -- all the craziness I've gone through to where somebody wants me to -- to represent...you know, that -- that's real humbling in my opinion. And -- and you asked me about being with the VAV. After I joined the VFW, some of the guys in the VFW was in the VAV, and they asked me to join. I think within the first year they made me quartermast -- I mean, ajutant, which is the same thing as quartermaster. It's the treasurer. And -- and -- apparently I did the job well enough, and they recommended me to go to the State. And -- and in the State level I was ajutant, which is the second highest office in the State -- on the State level. And -- and I was real proud of that in the sense that I was the first black that ever held that position. Believe me, I caught hell with it, though. But -- and... Then I was recommended to run for this office that I now hold, which is National JeopardyCommittee for the 13th District which represents the State of Kentucky and Indiana. I went to the national convention, was nominated and elected, and you see me here today --

Pat McClain:

That's great.

Lee Ewing:

-- and I'm -- I'm -- sometimes they -- they get on my nerves, sometimes they really do, but I know I'm doing something good and I don't let the -- the few petty people that's involved in it get me down. I won't tell you no lies, sometimes they get to me. All right? And I don't want to sound racist, but there's a bunch of people in the sticks of Kentucky that just ain't ready for people of color to come up to any stature yet, but -- you know, some days I get upset, but most days I float through it and just let it roll off me.

Pat McClain:

Well, you have to.

Lee Ewing:

Oh, yeah.

Pat McClain:

I mean, --

Lee Ewing:

I been in the war long enough --

Pat McClain:

-- they're just stupid people.

Lee Ewing:

Yeah, and all of them it ain't got nothing to do with color, --

Pat McClain:

No.

Lee Ewing:

-- they're just stupid. You know.

Pat McClain:

That's true.

Lee Ewing:

But... But...

Pat McClain:

I didn't say that.

Lee Ewing:

But...

Pat McClain:

Is there anything that you might want to add that you haven't said that you want to make sure that's on this -- this tape or --

Lee Ewing:

I -- I --

Pat McClain:

-- do you think you...

Lee Ewing:

I could probably sit here for two -- two or three days and relate stuff that happened in Vietnam, but I guess, if I wanted to say anything, it's that, believe it or not, I'm truly proud of -- of serving and truly proud of the job I did in Vietnam. If you were to ask me today if I was 20 years old and I knew what I knew today, would I go back and do it again, no, I wouldn't. I really wouldn't, but I wouldn't trade the experience for nothing in the world. The Marine Corps made a man out of me in ways that -- that, if you've never been in the military, you probably just don't understand. It taught me a lot of self-discipline in a lot of things, and -- and I truly think what you guys are doing here is -- is going to be very, very significant in time to come. I -- I've never probably, with the exception of my posttraumatic stress programs, never sit up and candidly talked like this with anybody, never, 'cause, I -- I mean, I may have teared up a time or two here, I don't know, but I know when I do relate these stories, it gets to me. Even to this, and I'm 35 years out of Vietnam, but some of these things it's just as clear today as they were in Nam.

Pat McClain:

Right. Do you think it's helpful?

Lee Ewing:

Today I do.

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

But there's a lady named Marty U-sing (ph). She's the art therapist that used to work at the VA that I -- I -- I truly just sort of credit her with bringing me back to life. She was one of the counselors that I worked with out there, and she somehow got me to the point where I could talk, and I don't know how she -- well, that's not quite true either, 'cause I wouldn't talk to her and -- and -- she would -- she's an art therapist, and she would have guys work with clay and paint, and I didn't have those kind of talents and I didn't know how to express it like that. Then one day she said, "Well, why don't you sit down and write a short story." And I still have that short story to this day. If I'd have thought about it, I'd brought it in, 'cause it's in the car

Pat McClain:

Oh, that would be great.

Lee Ewing:

And I -- and she asked -- I wrote this short story, and I was talking about Sheehan. Let me tell this story. You just triggered something. Christmas of 1967. And I -- I related to you what Sheehan meant to me as a person.

Pat McClain:

Um-hmm. Um-hmm.

Lee Ewing:

They had -- in Vietnam they had -- we had sea rations. When we was out in the bush, we'd eat sea rations. A lot of times we didn't have hot meals, and -- and they come in cases and boxes -- boxes within the case, and -- and there was one -- one sea ration line that had a pound cake in it, a little pound cake in a can about that big around, and another case of sea rations had a little can of apricots in it. All right? And -- and for whatever reason, I mean, I pigged out on those any time I could, but they come in two separate cases, and -- and -- I would steal cases of sea rations 'cause I keep 'em on my crane, but I would steal 'em just to get these two items out of a whole case, and then I'd sell them or give them away or whatever I did with them. And -- and -- I remember -- I will never forget Christmas of 1967. We'd been in the field about a half a day. We come in early because it was Christmas, and -- and I was laying in my bunk, and Sheehan walked up to me and he threw a can of apricots and a can of -- of pound cake on the bed and said, "Merry Christmas," and to this day --

Pat McClain:

Oh, my gosh.

Lee Ewing:

-- to this day I've never, ever received a better Christmas present. And then to think that a month and a half later he was dead. I mean, Marty used to... try to get us to go to DC to go to the Wall and -- and telling us how it could help us and that kind of stuff, and I didn't go for a lot of years. The first --

Pat McClain:

It's incredible, isn't it?

Lee Ewing:

Yeah. The first time I went was in 1994, and they had a big blizzard that year. It was '93 or '94, the blizzard -- what do you call it? But, anyway, I drove up. I drove up by myself 'cause I didn't want anybody else to go with me and I -- 'cause I didn't know how I was going to react, and I didn't want to be -- witness to being a punk or something like that. I drove up by myself. I checked into a hotel, and -- and I went straight to the Wall. And -- and... I looked up Sheehan's name. I looked up -- oh, God, I just mentioned his name, the other Marine that got shot up.

Pat McClain:

McCray was his name?

Lee Ewing:

McCoy.

Pat McClain:

McCoy.

Lee Ewing:

Yeah, I looked up McCoy's name, and that's when I found out he didn't die that day on the bridge, he died about three days later. But I looked up those two names because I remembered those two names, and then I got mad at myself 'cause I didn't know any of the other Marines that got killed out there on that bridge, but -- and that's when I found out Sheehan's first name. I couldn't remember it from the time --

Pat McClain:

Oh, when you saw it.

Lee Ewing:

Yeah, --

Pat McClain:

Oh.

Lee Ewing:

-- when I seen it on the wall. It's a -- If you've ever been there, the registry --

Pat McClain:

I have.

Lee Ewing:

-- and -- and -- and -- you know, I knew where he was from and I knew his last name, and I knew that wouldn't be a real common name, and that's when I remembered -- well, I didn't remember him, but read it. And then, when I read it, I remembered it, yeah, his first name was Charles.

Pat McClain:

Have you ever been able to get in touch with his family?

Lee Ewing:

Never tried. I mean, I said I was and -- and -- I -- I -- I don't know what I would say. You know, all I know is I was there the day he died, you know, and -- and -- I --

Pat McClain:

Oh, but they would love the story about the pound cake.

Lee Ewing:

Oh, God.

Pat McClain:

That was so sweet. I mean, they would really like that. For you to sit here and say that's the best Christmas present you've ever.

Lee Ewing:

I mean, and I'm telling you from that day to this nothing has compared, and it was such a simple gesture. It wasn't wrapped up or nothing. He just threw it on the bunk and said, "Here, Merry Christmas."

Pat McClain:

Yeah, but I mean --

Lee Ewing:

And I will never forget that.

Pat McClain:

Yeah, me too. Me too. Well, is it okay if I take your picture?

Lee Ewing:

That's fine. Can you wait until I stop crying?

Pat McClain:

I certainly will. Thank you so much for sharing this with us and.

[CONCLUSION OF INTERVIEW]